Mine are aubible by anyone present and paying attention. I will put money on this, swear my soul on it. They'll have you devastated in a matter of minutes. Mikey

I too am a mental health prof. However, after several stays in hospital i too learned the horrible 'rules' you described. Seeing it all wrote down moved me to tears, i'm so angry and sad that that is the reality of our care. Then the b******s wonder why we wont talk!

I can well understand Mikey's and Karen's comments in response to my article, 'Hidden Demons', about hearing voices. Sometimes the voices that I heard were audible to me as well as other people and almost telapathic. Goffman also describes the 'rules' and 'degradation ceremonials' in the books 'Asylums' and 'Stigma' which are well worth a read.

I spent about 5mos in a state hospital after being in and out short term. I've been hospital free for over a year but I am so afraid of telling anyone about my voices being back. I'm so afraid of going back, like those "rules" that you talk about. I'm so worried when I see my therapist writing during our session, I think he calls my mom and tells her what I say.

Yes, Tonya, I have had exactly the same fears. The main thing to remember is that you have, as you said, been hospital free for over a year. That's really good and you should try to think about this when meeting your therapist, mental health professionals or your psychiatrist. In certain circumstances, your therapist or psychiatrist can disclose information about your mental health difficulties. In general, however, they have a duty of confidentiality. If you want anything you say kept between you and your therapist just say: "I would prefer to keep what I say confidential". If your Mum is your carer, then she will very much be worried about you and may need support from voluntary organisations or carer support groups, so don't leave her 'out in the cold'. As I said, you've been hospital free, so just think of that as a major achievement.

I started hearing voices at the end of 2003. For years it was a constant blast coming from all angles. Everywhere I went, they followed. When I woke up in the morning it sounded as if there were people just outside my window waiting for me to wake up. Coincidentally I felt everyone was talking about me in some sort of dual language. I felt this got taken as some sort of joke and was publisized on television. This seemed to be the big thing as everyone started giving a get out of here thumb. I thought there is an internet site about me or I was on the radio or something as people seemed to know who I was, however I have yet to find out what caused everyone to give this hand gesture. I think there has been a bunch of songs about me all sorts of stuff in entertainment as I felt I have been used as some sort of experiment which is mind reading. Suquently the movie Stranger than Fiction came out and is about a guy who is walking around with a voice that is a real person. I feel that I am not crazy but this really happened to me. If someone could tell me why everyone was giving that hand gesture it would relieve alot of tension from me.

Hi Nick- I had a similar experience and the voices I heard shouted at me. The voices also used the same voices as people around me, which was awful as I never knew if someone was talking to me or whether it was a voice inside my head. Some of the people I met while in a psychiatric acute unit shouted back at their voices, and this was both frightening as well as making me feel sorry for them. I also thought people made hand gestures at me too, although in my case they pointed down, which I took to mean that I was going to hell. I heard angels and demons and actually spent a week without food and four days without water, as the angels said there was no hunger or thirst in heaven and that I would have to make my way to God. This was an experience I wouldn't want to repeat or recommend that anyone else attempts. One piece of advice that a fellow patient gave me was to argue with your voices and not do what they say- so it's more like a discussion on what you should do and which therefore always leaves you with a choice, and let's face it, choices are pretty thin in a psychiatric unit.

Its nice to see people communicating freely. I was hospitalised 7 times. Once in Dunedin, NZ which is close to you. I was there visiting my brother. Its great to see people finally discussing the voices and people that they hear. The more I read the more I realise how similar peoples experiences are. Which makes me realise that we are all seeing the same thing which is interesting. I think the spiritual world as I call it is amazing but also at times very violent. One thing I dont get is why there is so much violence in this world. I was basically beaten senseless spiritually. What I went through was extreme and I ended up screaming in agony. But they way I was treated by mental health was worse. That I was locked away, held down, injected, degraded, and abused. Im still so shocked at the way I was treated. When it is so simple to except peoples experiences as real. I had to move states to get away from the abuse that I experienced from the mental health system. I cant believe it happened to me. I studied Psychology, graduated in the top 20 in my class got into honours and then assumed I would do a Doctorate and then possible graduate medicine and psychiatry. I then made the mistake of telling a psychiatrist that I see ghosts. They didnt let me leave and I was hospitalized for 6 weeks. Im lucky it wasnt a year as I dont know how Id survive the mind numbing boredom of being in a hospital. It was weird I went from someone training to be a mental health professional to being a patient. I was one of those patients that refused to give in. The pscyhiatrists just couldnt understand why I would simply call myself mentally ill and accept my medication. So I was labelled as treatment non-compliant and as having lack of insight which basically means I refused to abuse myself. So I escaped. Hilarious. I actually had to move states. Luckily I got away with it. So now Ive be criminalised apparently which is horrifying. So why is it that mental health is criminalised. That psychiatrists have the right to arrest, detain, medicate and withstrain people while giving them usually wrong labels. It so sad that we live in a world like this. They are currently reviewing the mental health Act is South Australia. Basically its that same scenario. People are basically labelled, then medicated and detained. It sick. So I hope there someone out there who likes to get political because maybe it can make a difference. But I assuming that it will just get ignored and they continue to lock away anyone labelled as mentally ill. It's hard sometimes having no one to talk to. Theres no support group in the state I live in and also I cant afford to ruin my professional reputation because it could effect my job. So Im living a lie. I dont tell anyone that I see people and that they talk to me. Did you know that currently theres a class action in Australia against the makers of Zyprexa. So if any of you out there have had harmful side effect from being given Olazapine you should get in touch with the lawyers in Queensland. Its on the net. Hope you are all well and happy and guess what you are not alone. There are millions of other people out there going through just what you are experiencing.

Hi Jane, I was very moved by your account and like you have to 'hide' my mental health problems due to stigma and how it would affect my work. Apparently 1 in 8 people suffer from some form of mental health problem at some point in their lives, so you're right, we're not alone. Having said this, care in the community in this country (the UK) often means no care in the community, which can leave people with mental health problems feeling that they are alone. There are limited resources, little money, a lack of in-patient beds and the burden of care often falls on family carers, who have little knowledge of how to help someone in distress. In addition to this, powerful anti-psychotic drugs are over-prescribed and may be harmful in the long-term. In my opinion, psychiatry is too scientized and forgets that people like us, with mental health problems, are human beings with valid thoughts, feelings and emotions, however bizarre or strange these may seem to other people. I hope you stay well and stay out of hospital.

The first time I heard voices I was 11 years old. It was after my friends and I had played with a ouija ("weegee") board to try to contact spirits at one of my friend's houses. On my way walking home that night I heard voices all around me trying to talk to me. I was so scared I ran home as fast as I could. Over the next few years I got into drugs. First I smoked and drank once in a while. Then I smoked some marijuana now and again. Then I began smoking it all the time, and I began taking acid once in a while (LSD). That is when I really started hearing the voices again. I took an extreeeeeeemly large dose of LSD and after that the voices were very prominent. They would tell me to do things, like go grab some random woman's behind, or go say some strange comment to someone. They once had me convinced that everyone in the world was dying of AIDS except me, and I cried in school all day. People thought I was such a freak. I was I suppose. I quit drugs and stopped hanging out with my friends who had gotten me into drugs. I just wanted the voices to go away. I tried ignorning the voices and telling myself they weren't real for a year, telling myself that they were just the LSD lingering in my head. However they would do things to "prove" themselves to me. For instance I distinctly remember one day I told one of the voices it wasn't real, and it said, "Oh yeah... then how would I know you're dad is going to knock on you're door right... right... NOW," and just then my father knocked on my door. After that I decided the voices were real. I mean, what is more real then seeing through walls and telling me things that are about to happen? But I was still plagued by them. I would try to not listen to them, but they would convince me of ridiculous things (like the AIDS thing I mentioned) and instruct me to do strange things like go pull some random person's hair a little to annoy them or something. All this changed one evening when I was at a church meeting my friend invited me too. I had been to church before and would've liked to believe in God and Jesus Christ, but I just thought it was so much bull$#!^ and too unbelievable. But that night something happened. Nothing fancy. We all had hung out and done a habitat for hummanity type project and afterwards the preacher just read a verse from the Bible. I don't even remember what it was and honestly didn't even really listen to it, but I just know as he was reading it I felt like chains were breaking off my hands and shackles were broken off my feet. I felt free, and I began to weep. I had been unable to believe in God and Christ and then I just felt overwhelming beleif. I prayed, something I had never been able to get myself to do since the voices had started. I thanked God. The voices had never made me feel so free. This was a very, very good feeling. Since that night the voices have not bothered me. Literally. Like someone turned the switch off. That leads me to believe that the voices had something to do with the spiritual world. However, sometimes I think maybe my faith just gives me so much peace that it overcame my mental illness, and "demons" had nothing to do with it. I go back and forth between thinking the voices were demons at times and thinking they were just mental illness at other times. I suppose it is significant that I heard the voices for the first time after trying to summon spirits of the dead with the ouija board, and that was before I ever got into drug abuse of any kind (definately years before I tried LSD and even before I ever tried weed). Maybe it was demons. Then again, maybe it was just all in my mind... because they really took hold only after I started abusing mind altering substances. On the otherhand, perhaps demons are more able to iscrew with someone who is "sinning" (via drug abuse). I don't know. All I know is that I felt like I didn't have to listen to the voices any more after I became a believer. Even though they were "real" and they could prove themselves to me, Jesus Christ was even more real and the only thing I had to believe was his Word. I researched the history surrounding His life and death and found it to actually be believable (as long as you're willing to accept the 'paranormal' or supernatural... and the voices had already convinced me to accept that). Also, there have been instances where His Spirit interacted with me and produced "real" events in my life similar to those the 'voices' could... but much better. Like a peaceful thought will enter my mind and I just sense it is from God, and then I'll open the Bible and the exact word that was in my mind is on the first place I look at the first random page I open it to... So anyway, sorry for the long story. But I've never journaled or written this stuff down, and writing this gave me a good excuse to do that. Every once in a while I'll think I hear a voice or something, but it goes away very quickly (like within one second) and I think it is just my own thoughts (if that makes any sense). I just no longer have any problems with the voices. I wonder sometimes if they'll ever come back.

Dear Jason, It sounds like you've gone through a lot and you're not alone. Many of the people I have met in hospital have used drugs and alcohol and psychiatrists even believe that there is a link between using marijuana and mental illness. One of the people I met when I was under Section in hospital told me that she saw people on fire and heard voices. She also said that she used to drink a bottle of vodka every night. She was very lonely. There were people who used drugs on the ward and strangely both staff and patients tried to avoid these people and called them 'junkies'., which is quite dehumanising. I've a friend whose experience is very close to yours, who basically over-dosed on LSD/ Acid. He too hears voices commanding him to hit people or shout them down. It's good that you've found faith and I find fellow Christians very supportive and understanding. In a way, psychiatry has tried to take over from religious or spiritual beliefs, leading to a narrow medical approach that depends on anti-psychotic drugs to control people's subjectivity, their experiences and behaviour. It's good that your only hearing whispers of voices now (I'm the same), which I hope means that we're well on the road to recover and have survived mental illness.

I have only heard voices one time in my life. After having been referred to a psychiatric ward unit following a very trying and difficult treatment at the hospital for ulcerative colitis which actually made me delusional. It didn't sound like normal voices, but the voices I heard was rather similar to the ones of animated cartoon characters, it was like listening to a prerecorded cassette of somebody's voice at double speed. At the psychiatric ward I also had a visual hallucination. I was looking at a doorway, and it was empty and the door closed, but suddenly one of the psych nurses just stood there, I had no idea how she had gotten there. First the door was closed and the next second she was just standing there, I had no idea how it happened. It was like a video recording where 30 seconds had just been cut. Anyway, I told the staff that I had heard voices and that I was afraid I was becoming schizophrenic, but they told me I wasn't. I was put on medication for the voices, and they never returned, not even after a couple of weeks when I was discharged from the psychiatric ward unit I got off the psych medication. The voices never returned, and this was about 7 years ago. I think the voices were triggered by the stressful state I was in after the treatment for my ulcerative colitis.

I have been hearing voices for almost two years. I hate them. They are evil. I hear things, such as the voices, I smell of evil smoke, I feel things, have evil dreams and I just can't go on much longer. I need help. I would like to know the medication you took Carl that helped you. The voices I hear claim to be demons from hell and want me to commit suicide. I don't want to hurt myself but I just feel that my situation is hopeless. If anyone reads this please help me and pray for me and when you pray ask God that I not get punished for telling you these things. I'm afraid of the future. I'm a christian,a good and honest person, this shouldn't be happening to me but it is. Please help me, please. I am even saved but I feel that this is not auditory hallucinations but possibly, I am somehow involved in spiritual war that is going on around us and that I don't have a guardian angel protecting me from the evil voices. I rarely get to dream, and I have memory problems,problably from God just making forget everything that I have seen in my dreams. I get tortured and tormented everyday. In many ways I have been tortured and I believe I will have a bad night by telling everyone these things because its the truth. Please respond and help me. I believe that if everyone who is hearing voices will just stick together, we can get through this in time. The one thing I have learned while going through this is patience. Again, please help me. pray for me and contact local churches and all churches and get them to put not only me, but everyone that is going through this on their prayer list, for a long time, to pray for us everyday until our suffering has ended. Please help everyone.

Hi Lee Guess what theres somebody out there. I know what your going through and I know that it is real. If you ever need to talk just get in touch. Ill help you as much as I can. Where do you live? I live in Australia. If you want I can give you my phone number and you can call me if you need to talk to someone. Send me an email if you like at hcarman@hotmail.com and Ill give you my number. Hope you are going ok. Try and get out and enjoy the sunshine. Your not on your own. Heather

Hi Lee, You're not alone. I had very similar experiences when under Section in hospital- with evil voices, rotting smells, terrible night-long nightmares and a fear that people were going to kill me, by hanging, and that I would go to hell. My advice would be to talk with trusted friends and perhaps charitable Christians at the church you attend. Having read your story I feel very sorry as well as nervous for you. Remember that you're stronger than your voices and a better person than the demonic voices that you hear. I would also strongly suggest that you have a mental health assessment. Although I disagree with a lot of psychiatry and mental health nursing, there are some circumstances when being in hospital, even under section, is preferable and safer to being in the community with the feeling that you are alone. I will pray for you and others like us, but strongly suggest that if you're still in distress to go into hospital as a voluntary patient, until you feel less lost and in pain and so that you learn to cope with your voices. You're not on your own.

Hi Lee, I forgot to say that in most areas there are service user or survivor groups and self-help groups. You might want to try one of these as you'll meet with people who share similar experiences of hearing voices, gain ideas from people and strategies to help you in your daily life to cope more insighfully with hearing voices. You're not on your own.

I want to thank everyone on this site for their imput. I'm not one to have many voices, in fact I can often discern the voices I do get as my own, but even those scare me. I took very strong LSD a few months ago and since have had paranoid delusions that people around me are either demons, illuminati conspirators, not real, etc. I often hear the devil in my head trying to tell me he can kill me and that the road to being saved is to do evil deeds. He often either speak in hisses or in a low grumble that almost sounds like rocks crackling together. My saving grace is that it seems god also often speaks to me and tells me what is right and to be good. His voice is usually characterized as thunderous and booming or otherwise zenlike and wise similar to a Mr. Miagi. I find however that they often resemble my voice as well so this gives me some comfort. A young man named Jason wrote on this thread that he turned to God and found salvation in total and stopped hearing the voices. As I turn to God and Christ I also seem to find more hope and strength. I have heard many similar cases. It is wounderous how the mind works, sometimes you question if it is just finding power mentally, or if it does have to with a more esoteric and supernatural reason. All in all I feel better in Christ and even though for much of my life I have refuted the idea, I am looking to be converted to Catholicism. Everyone needs strength, and I hope all of you have or will find it. Just have faith!!! And once again thank you all for sharing and thank you Dr. Ben Gray for creating such a wonderful thread!

Hi Claude, I turned to Christianity as well, which I think has helped me to cope more insightfully, well-roundedly and holistically with my voices. Similar to you, I also heard angels and demons. In my opinion, psychiatry is quite 'narrow-minded' and does not allow for the inclusion of voice hearer's experiences, hopes, fears, worries and even the place of their faith. Hopefully this will begin to change as the hearing voices movement grows and their is more user and carer involvement in the development of mental health services. They say that the truth will set you free, so all the best in the future for all of us who hear voices.

Heather, I've seen your posts on here in more than one place. Do you offer free help? There is no one here I can talk to about this. The one person I've told won't speak to me any more. I live alone so it's hard to know if anyone hears it. But my dog does. His reactions make it clear it can be heard by others.

Hi Dean, There might be a local group for people who hear voices or who have mental health problems in your area. There's also the Hearing Voices Network (http://www.hearing-voices.org/), who have a forum that might help. MIND is also a good place to seek help.

i have experienced the voices for years,and they too take the voice of people around me(almost if i can read their minds)..but i told myself that its an inbalance in my brain and the reason that the voices in my head take the voice of people that i know is b/c its something that my brain knows.and so i wouldnt hear them as much anymore,however lately i've been hearing these voices more..again. and its not just people that i know,its people out in public.and whats worse is i have been smelling a smell around me or on me that smells bad,for about a week now.and most of(not all) the voices in my head are telling me that i stink.i am a saved but back sliding spirit.im not real sure whats going on with me.so i had to do some research and i found this web site(which i can relate to).and also now for some reason in my mind i respond to the voices and they reply back and i know that its not things that i would say! and i know that im a pretty sane person(more than most people that i know,that are normal...they even tell me that!)

Hi Amy, I had similar experiences to you, with voices of people shouting at me when I went out to town (escaping from the psychiatric unit on day leave). I also experienced a strange scent, but only once, and it smelled like rotting flesh or a corpse. I hope that you're learning to cope with your voices and get the chance to lead as 'normal' a life as possible. There is quite a lot of recent research that suggests that people who hear voices can live quite ordinary lives, given the right support and coping strategies.

I have been hearing a single voice, for the past three years, the voice is coming from a living indian guru, she is very demonic, but she does not scare me. Has anyone else heard a voice from a living person?

I used to hear the voices of people around me, saying very nasty and abusive things. Luckily, I only hear whispers now. It's good that you can cope with your voices and are not scared by them.

I have recently started hearing voices. It always happens when I am waking up from a (usually restless) night's sleep. It sounds like a door has opened to a crowded room with people chattering (like in a busy restaurant). A few days ago, I woke up thinking a talk radio station was playing in another room. I went in to find nothing, but quiet. I was freaked out. Could it be I am mentally ill or stressed or just a 50+ tired woman who is sick of her job and life in general? I have been on Prozac for about 3 years now. Doesn't really help my depression. No, I'm not suicidal (too afraid of going to hell). I just want to sleep peacefully...and wake to peace and quiet. Any suggestions will be appreciated.

I appreciate everyones honesty. I have been hearing these same voices. I take meds that dullen the voices , but every morning and throughout the day until evening is an agonizing harrassment. Every thought i think I recieve comments from voices that claim they are fallen angels.

Hi Deborah, It does depend on what the voices are saying to you and your relationship with your voices. If this is a first time episode, then the voices might go away. Prozac, stress and being sick of work/ personal life can all lead to a nervous breakdown (I know from experience). Is there anyone you can really trust (friend, relative, someone who you know who has had a similar experience?) that you can talk to and turn to for support? You may also want to see your GP (although if they think you're 'psychotic' and unwell this might lead to a voluntary or compulsory (a section) treatment in a psychiatric acute unit (and believe me, I found it awful). Maybe someone else on this web thread can advise better???

I guess what I would say to both John and Deborah is that it's good to talk with someone trusted about your voices, who you know will care and try and support you. It's also good to try and think what's behind the voices (ie- I heard demons, so you could ask was it actaully demons talking to me or did I somewhere deep down think that I'd done something wrong and deserved punishment?). I haven't any solutions and agree that voices can really get in the way of a 'normal' and happy life. There's a good book that I've just read by Ron Coleman called 'Hearing Voices II- From Victim to Victor' that is a good read and very useful. Hang on in there and keep fighting!

Sorry, I forgot to say that the book by Ron Coleman and Mike Smith (Hearing Voices II- From Victim to Victor) also says that hearing voices in not an uncommon experience and should have the stigma taken away from it. The book/ pamphlet also suggests ways of coping with hearing voices and helps you in thinking about looking for trusted people who will support you, as well as helping to work out your relationship with your voices. It's quite a short book so a quick and good read. Just another quick fact- Apparently 1 in 3 people suffer from some form of mental health problem sometime in their lives (Meaning it is not an uncommon or bad experience that will defeat you). All the best, Ben.

Hi Deborah, I taked to two very experienced mental health nurses yesterday about your predicament. From what you say, they believe that it is likely that the voices come from your present personal/ life situation. They also said that Prozac does have some side-effects (although they didn't know if voice hearing was one of them). The nurses may or may not be right, as they don't know all the information about you, but I thought I would get in touch to try and help a little. All the best, Ben.

My daughter keeps talking about her "brain" talking to her. This has been going on for a few months now. She is almost 7yrs old. At first she only mentioned it every now and then. I asked her if she was just "thinking" inside herself but just not saying it out loud. Or if her brain was saying the same thing "she" was really saying when she talked. She said yeah so I just figured that she caught on to being about to hear yourself think in your head. She would only mention her "talking brain" every now and then. Usually to me or sometimes me and my husband. And when she did say something about it it was just out of the blue like, " I was playing and my brain said this or that." and she would go into this vivid detail of some made up off the wall story. I just blew it off as normal weird kid stuff. I don't attend church anymore but yes I do believe, I have my reasons. But my Grandma goes to our little family church every Sunday and has started taking my daughter with her. Lane, my daughter, enjoys it very much and has great fun going. She believes in God and Jesus and understands it all more than I would expect a child to. My Grandma asked me yesterday if Lane ever mentions anything about her "brain" talking to her. Oh no, I knew what had happened, Lane has being hearing her "brain" talking more and is now telling others, which she has never done before. I knew what was coming when I said yes and asked my grandma if she was talking about Lane saying her "brain" is talking to her. Of course, grandma said yes, exactly that. Lane has been telling Miss. Lucy, the Sunday school teacher, about her "brain". Lane has been diagnosed with severe AD/HD for almost 2 years now. She takes 20mg's of Adderal every day!! She can not miss a dose cause if she does all hell breaks lose. No one can stand to be around her, not even grandma, if she hasn't taken her meds. It took a long time to finally get lane's meds just right but we finally did last year around November and it's been great. She is a different person when she's on the meds. But that's also about the time her "brain" came about. For the last month and a half now she has slid into a hole. It seems like she isn't even on her meds, but she is, she has a very severe mood switch and a very bad temper. She is hateful to her little brother who is 4, screaming at him, demanding him at everything he does when they play, making him do stuff for her cause she is too "lazy" to do it herself. Then the next minute she's fine and just as nice as she can be to him. Like nothing ever happened. When her "mood" takes over I have to stop her and tell her to leave him alone. She hits him and screams at him, it's crazy how she can act at times. (Sorry I know "crazy" isn't the right thing to say but that's just how it seems. I don't know how else to explain it.) At times they will be playing nice and she will just out of the blue tell him to punch her or crap like that or ask him if he wants to "cat fight" ( we have cats so that is where this idea comes from I guess) and they pretend to be cats, hissing and clawing. I just assumed they are pretending to be cats and playing. but she is the only one who suggests playing this "game". And Lord, the way she acts with me is just getting to the where I feel like I'm going to have a mental break down and I am getting to the point to where I can't take it anymore! One minute she's fine and happy and then BOOM it's like she turns in to someone else, like a alter ego. She throws fits and screams and melts down over anything. She argues and will not stop unless she gets the last word no matter what. And then depending on how long it lasts, 5 minutes or an hour, it's like nothing ever happened. She goes on like everything is fine and nothing just happened. And if you ask her about what happened she just gives me this blank, stupid look like she has no clue what I'm talking about and says huh or " I don't know". Like she wasn't even there. What the heck?! She does the same thing in school one day or week or weeks she's fine then she turns into this little < I don't know what> and won't do anything the teacher asks her to do or her work or sit down and stop talking and moving around. Then the next day it's back to normal. I just assumed this was from the AD/HD. She failed school last year and was doing to great the first half of the year this time but after Christmas she just stopped. She could have pasted this year but it's like she doesn't even care and just quit trying and now she is failing again with no chance of passing. She gets special help at school every day and the school knows about "her" problems. Not the "brain" thing though. I have requested that she be put in special education for next year cause I believe she really needs it and maybe that's the only way she will make it in school for now. But it has gotten to the point where my husband says she needs help and something is more wrong with her. I believe so to and I fell at loss cause I just can't handle her anymore before I end up snapping and going to the hospital for me. I know mental illness can run in families. My mom is bipolar with severe depression( I had depression but have learned to shut it out) and post tramatic stress. I have an uncle on my dad's side who is schizo in the worst way. I'm bipolar, OCD, and have severe moods myself. But I can control mine now, for the most part. But I'm afraid she's going to push me too far and I'm going to snap. Not on her, that's not what I mean. I mean go back into a state where I can't handle being around people anymore and go back inside of my head again. Like my own little world and block others out, shutdown, I don't want to or have the time ( i also have the 2 boys ages 4 and 1) to go back in the hospital again. I've been twice and that was enough for me. ( Me, that's a whole different story) I'm so afraid she is going to turn into me if she hasn't already done so or worse. She's only 7. I'm afraid of how this all will affect my 4 yr old also because of how she treats him, nice one minute then the evil little demon she becomes. I'm afraid he's going to have to "do something" to cope with all this. The tension is so high in the house and knife isn't big enough to cut through it. We try to act as normal as we all can and like everything is normal and we do till Lane flips out yet again. I believe this is way more than just AD/HD. But her doctor acts like meds will get rid of anything. He says "how is she doing, ok lets go up on the mg's and try this." Hey, I've been there. I know all too well about all the meds being changed constantly trying this or that and finally you wake up one day and realize "Hey, I'm taking 10-20 pills a day just so I can try to act like everyone else, what the hell happened to me?" I don't think a hospital is going to do her any good cause it's a controlled enviroment. She would never have a "mood" there except for when they try to give her meds maybe (that's a power struggle and sets a mood every morning till after she finally takes it and acts like nothing happened again). At home or else where in the REAL world where she has as much freedom as a child can have is where she does her "flipping or moods" as I call it. I hear about bad kids or tantrums and all the crap but this isn't the same and I don't know anyone who can relate to this. I need someone to please tell me what the heck I should do that is in the best interest for Lane. Not what can help them to deal with her. Please, anyone...

Hi Jamie, It sounds like a very very difficult situation. Do you have any family support? Family support workers might help, as they specialise in children and families, especially with respite care and giving parents a break. They take kids out on trips too. An empathetic child psychologist might also be of some use. More generally, have you tried rewards to encourage good behaviour (for example, a colourful wall chart with stars for good behaviouror a treat each time Lane does something nice)? I'm no expert, but the medication sounds like it's not working. Can anyone else suggest something?

Hi Jamie. You should read the book "your Drug May be your problem". Quite often there can be serious side effects to medication given to children for ADHD. I am not sure about adderall, but I read in the book that ritalin can cause side effects of depression etc, as it is an amphetamine after all. She would cause Hell if missing a dose, due to withdrawal symptoms. Many prescription drugs can cause severe withdrawals when taken off them, leading people to think that they therefore need more. Strangely some of these psychiatric drugs can cause depression and manic episodes, the very thing they are meant to treat. There is also a good article on this about site about Children Hearing Voices. Also there is a lot of research done on children with ADHD and nutrition by a man I have met called Woody McGinnis. You can google him and read some of his research, or email me. I am from the Hearing Voices Network In NZ at hearingvoices@woosh.co.nz and I will send you some of the info from his lecture. he also does work with autistic children and says that the nutritional deficiencies are similar, and can be quite profound. He had a child with severe adhd, which he treated successfully with Zinc, Vit B5 supplements among others. Zinc drops seem to be very effective in calming adhd children, as well as avoiding foods that are high in additives and processed products. Many people are not even aware the effect drinking soft drinks can have on a child. You can have tests by Doctors or naturopaths to see what you maybe deficient in.In can be quite surprising. He said that their bodies are killing off all the oxygen cells, and many have pale skin and blonde hair as a result of it coming through the skin as hydrogen peroxide. His sons hair went from Blonde to brown after taking zinc supplements. Foods that are antioxidants are also advised such as broccoli, blueberries. Regards Adrienne

Thanks Adrienne for your support of Jamie- Sounds like very good advice.

I have heard voices claiming to be demons for 8 years. I can even blast music and I will still hear them but if I listen to talk radio even at a low volume I do not seem to hear them. I hope this might help someone else.

Hi Pat, Thanks- I've heard voices from the TV before, so this will help.

Hi Ben, I was just wondering if you might consider any of things that happen to you supernatural. For example: My voices will start saying things like "I can't believe how stupid this guy is." or "What a f#cken idiot." just before I make some kind of stupid mistake. It has become quite evident to me that they are always referring to these mistakes before they happen. I don't mean to scare anyone but I would just like to know if anyone has experienced the same type of thing. Thank you

Hi Pat, I had the belief that both angels and demons had forewarned me about the terrible events of September 11th at the Twin Towers in New York. I also had a dream about a girl I saw a few times at University and she was drowning in the dream/ nightmare. So when I saw her next (I didn't know her but had just seen her around campus), I asked her if she was going on holiday and she said "yes", then I asked her if she was doing anything with water and she said she was doing some sort of water sport with waterfalls, then I tried to warn her but found it very hard (and irrational/ crazy) to articulate the dream's danger. Weeks later I saw in the local paper that she had drowned while on holiday with her mother. I remember feeling sick both about September 11th and the dream. Finally, when I was about 17 I had a very good friend who was into motorbikes. He invited me to go to a local motorbike show. I said "fine" and then it was as if an angel spoke through me: "Don't go, there's going to be an accident!", the angel said. "What accident", my friend said. "Oh nothing", another voice (a demon), said, "There's not going to be an accident". Unfortunately he (my best friend) died in a terrible road accident on the way to the show. This all sounds very crazy and would no doubt be called 'psychotic' but I did experience the supernatural/ religious and perhaps failed to act on the warnings I was given??? Has anyone had similar experiences? I would be interested to hear?

Hi again Pat, I think that a good point that needs to be made is that supernatural/ religious, strange or bizarre experiences and voice hearing should not be discounted and rejected (as psychotic or delusional, as done by most psychiatrists). It's good and important that voice hearers should communicate their experiences to other voice hearers, trusted friends and family and sympathetic health professionals in order to encourage discussion, debate and an understanding of the voices and what they mean. Rufus May (a clinical psychologist who was diagnosed as schizophrenic when a teenager) does this in his work, as shown very recently on Channel 4 TV (UK). The only person I have ever revealed the above supernatural/ religious beliefs to is a priest (who blessed me and said a prayer for me) but it's important that people who hear voices should communicate their voices and experiences to one another as well as to sympathetic people like Rufus May, Ron Coleman, Romme and Escher and through organisations such as Intervoice and the Hearing Voices Network.

Hi Ben, I agree that it is best to be able to discuss the experiences of hearing voices and all , but only with other people who hear voices. In my experience, I have found that there is such a stigma related to hearing voices that people, including doctors, treat you differently when you discuss them. I have very little use for the mental health system in my area. I have been treated with nothing but patronization and disrespect from them (Excluding a few of them who were good to me.). I was taking medication that made me no longer hear the voices but I did not like the side effects from it, so I am now trying to cope without medication. I hear them most of the time if I am not watching television or listening to talk radio. It sometimes does get very scary when I am hearing them and strange things do seem to happen but so far I have been able to deal with it. No one else in this world is even aware that I am presently hearing voices because it tends to scare my wife when I do tell her I am hearing them and I do not feel the need to tell anyone else at this moment. It has gotten very bad in the past when I had psychotic episodes but I was not as prepared to handle it as well as I am now. I use to let the voices scare me and I believe it was justifiably so. I would be in bed late at night and they would tell me that if I fell to sleep that the devil was going to possess my body and kill my family and at that time I wasn't prepared to take that chance, so I would get out of bed and go to the emergency ward at our local mental facility. (This happened quite a few times until I started to figure out that most of the things the voices said were full of sh#t, but the thing still scares me a bit is they do seem to know some things that I do not.) If it was not for television or talk radio then there is no way I could ever handle this without medication. I have never gone longer then a few months while hearing the voices without seeking professional help and getting medication. I am hoping that maybe just maybe this thing will run it's course someday and I will no longer hear the voices without medication. This has truly been a nightmare that I am desperately trying to wake myself from. I don't know if I can beat these voices but one thing is for certain, I will never give up!

I just want to list off some of the things that I hear the voices say either to me or to each other. "This is the stupidest guy we've ever done this to" or "You are the stupidest guy we have ever done this to." "We are going to torture you more than anyone has ever been tortured in Hell." "The Devil just went into your body." "You have no Idea what we are going to do to your daughter." They comment on my every thought and action so they say a lot of other stuff but those lines are the ones I hear repeated the most often."

Hi Pat, Your voices are horrible and it's understandable that you only want to talk to other voice hearers about them. Have you gone to any voice hearer support groups or the Hearing Voices Network- It might help??? I hope that you can stay off medication and out of the acute psychiatric unit. Keep fighting!

Hello, I've heard voices for almost four years now. It happened when I was nineteen, much like one of the other posters here, I was a psychology major at a very good science college and studying pre-med. My experience came after using ouiji boards. The only good I think that can come from the fact that it did come immediately after using the boards was that I knew I wasn't crazy. I saw ghosts. However, knowing I wasn't crazy offered very little consolation from the voices that screamed and belittled me. I went from not hearing anything to hearing SO MUCH ALL THE TIME. It was so loud I couldn't hear anyone else when they talked to me. I just stared at family and friends when they asked what was wrong with a big blank look and kept saying, "what? What? I can't hear you." I too spent my time in a mental institution. The experience was degrading. They treated me like I was stupid, as if I were little kid, and kept asking why I was acting so wierd. Was it my family? My relationship with my dad? My ex boyfriend? I never told them about the voices because I knew what they would do to me if they knew. But I couldn't act normal either. The voices abused me mentally and they attacked my body physically. I grew sick. I couldn't walk anymore. I was weak and fatigued. I lost weight. My body was in constant, agonizing pain. The pain would get so bad that I would pass out from it. The pain would make me scream out loud in a way that I never knew was possible to even feel so much pain to begin with. The voices would torture my mind and torture my body. I started shaking and having uncontrollable seizures. I dont' know how long the violence would've lasted. I became paranoid and I think I really did start to go a little crazy. I started thinking everyone was out to kill me. I told myself my body was in pain because I was being poisoned by my family and the voices encouraged the idea, telling me everyone was trying to kill me and that was why everything hurt so bad. Anyway, eventually I got some of my senses back and I began doing research on herbal remedies (I was in a deep hatred for hospitals and their methods by this time) and was convinced natural was better. I went to the grocery store and bought every single type of tea and plant available on the market and began drinking them all, all day and night (Since I didn't know what I needed, I figured I'd try them all). Surprisingly, after about a month, my health improved. The voices became less violent, and slowly there were less and less voices at all. I still hear voices, of course, but not the way I used to. It's a little more mild now and I have been able to go work again. They're no longer as violent and accusing but they're still always present and very irritating. At least they're quieter now. I only hear about two voices at the same time now whereas I used to hear up to twenty at once and like I said, they're not nearly as loud and violent. It's hard to believe it's already been almost four years since this whole thing started. I miss my privacy. I hate that I constantly feel like I'm being watched. I have to monitor my thoughts because the voices constantly listen and judge me. I woke up this morning crying because I was so upset that I have no privacy anymore and that was when I reminded myself that I'm not alone and there are other people in the same situation.

Hi Sophia, I can really relate to the things you said. I just want you to know that no matter how bad it gets, there are always things that can still be enjoyed in life. Try and not let the voices take all of the pleasures from your life. I find that this is the only way to hold on to any sense of sanity. I realize that it is not always easy but I always try and take a look at whats going on around the world and tell myself there are people a lot worse off than I am, so I should try and be thankful for the things that do bring me enjoyment in life. You sound like a very intelligent young woman and I am sure you will be able to find some kind of peace even if the voices remain. Remember, do not ever take what the voices say to heart for they just want you to lose your will. I am definitely no expert on this subject but I have gone through many of the things you described and I find these are the things that work best for me. I try to find as much humor in things as I possibly can. I love a good laugh and that is one thing that the voices will never take away from me. I wish you the best of luck and hope things will get better for you from here on.

HI Ben, No, I haven't joined any type of support groups or anything like that. Things have actually been going pretty well for me the past few days. The voices seem to have greatly diminished and I have had a lot more energy than usual. It's does seem to be very good to be able to share some of my experiences here. I don't think I would ever go out and join any type of support group because that would be a little bit too time consuming for me. However, I do have a question for you. With you being a doctor you would probably have a lot more insight on this. Whenever I did seek professional help the doctors almost seemed to avoid the fact that I was hearing voices of demons like it scared them a little. They acted like demons didn't exist but at the same time they acted like they were frightened to discuss it too much. Do doctors have the view that there is a good chance that these demons truly do exist but they just don't want accept it or they are fear to accept it.

Hi Sophia and Pat, I really liked reading your stories and thoughts about hearing voices (although it was difficult and painful to read about your hardships). I'm glad that the voices are growing quieter for you both (mine are just occasional whispers now). I agree with you both that psychiatry and being admitted to a psychiatric acute unit is degrading and anything you say can be taken out of context and construed as crazy or psychotic. It's good that all three of us have come up with more holistic, alternative and personal ways to deal with hearing voices. I don't think doctors believe that demons exist as they think of themselves as scientists, but yes I do think they many psychiatrists are afraid of the religious/ spiritual and supernatural (as science can't explain these phenomena). I went to a conference recently, where Ron Coleman spoke very eloquently. He said that a patient of Marius Romme (an eminent and 'radical' psychiatrist) had said: "How come you can go to church and talk to God and that's okay, but when God talks to me I'm insane?".

Hi Pat, thanks so much for your kind words. I felt the same way when I read many of the stories on here. I found that I can really relate to the stories on here and somehow it gives me a little more strength knowing that I"m not the only person that has to go through this

Hi Ben. I completely agree with you about the supernatural!!! I just think it's amazing because a lot of stories I hear from the few voice hearers I've met always tell me they've seen demons or angels or something from the paranormal, but the second a doctor catches the slightest idea of what you think you're hearing, they accuse you of being crazy. I had so many people telling me I was making it up. The experience in the mental institution was indeed very degrading. I was surprised by how mean and condescending the doctors were. I couldn't believe the way they were allowed to treat another human being. I love the quote you added at the end. It really clicks.

Hi Sophia- It is good to share stories, get support from each other and agree that present psychiatric treatment is degrading, quite condescending and narrow minded. Unfortunately (or perhaps wisely?), I haven't yet put this point to my psychiatrist (who's quite old-fashioned and believes in the effectiveness of antipsychotic medication). I have the intuition that if I say to my psychiatrist (or other member of the mental health team, such as a mental health nurse or even my GP) that medication is pretty useless and that voice hearing can be a positive experience that I might find myself admitted to an acute unit pretty swiftly. So I'm afraid I'm a bit of a 'coward' and just agree with mental health professionals that medication is good, that voice hearing is 'bad' and an illness and that I should continue taking a reduced dosage of clozaril (an antipsychotic). I guess another thing to learn from this is that no single one person can stand up against the power of psychiatry by themselves, so it's good to share stories and convincing criticisms of psychiatry so that we 'stand together'. It would be good if the hearing voices movement, such as Intervoice and the Hearing Voices Network, could somehow bring this together, in a concerted criticism of psychiatry by its members (us!) to change things. Sharing stories certainly gives us strength, but imagine what it would be like if we could convert this strength into change of the mental health system.

Hi Ben, You're absolutely right. I would love it if a group of people would stand up against the type of psychiatry that our countries practice. It's not that I completely condemn the practice of psychology but I feel that we, as human beings, have made it into a high and mighty criticisms of our fellow man, where doctors believe they are smarter and better and can just pop a pill into any man's mouth to make him "normal". Another bit of advice I wanted to share that i actually stumbled upon quite recently, and i did hear someone mention before that yelling at the voices help when they're being negative, is that if you sometimes say in your head to them (or out loud really loudly if you're alone and they're really getting out of hand), leave me alone please, go away please, don't embarrass me please, don't hurt me please, get out of my head please, it helps make them go away. It worked for me so if anyone's having problems, at least give it a try and hopefully it'll help them too.

Yes, a fellow voice hearer told me that it can be good to argue or respond to your voices (to answer them back). I would recommend that people might try this in private or with a therapist or very close friend who understands. I knew a girl who shouted all the time on the psychiatric ward where I was Sectioned and I think mental health professionals see shouting back at your voices in public a good excuse to give the person a sedative, which certainly calms people down but doesn't resolve the issues, the voices or any underlying problems.